Teraflex 2.5" BB - The death wobble has come...
12-28-2007, 06:09 PM
#23
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I too would be very interested in the bracket. I installed the TF BB on mine recently and the drivers side rear swaybar is literally 1/4" from the sidewall, with OEM 255's on the 7.5" rim. The passenger side has approx. 2" of clearance. Need to re-center!
12-28-2007, 06:13 PM
#24
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A few facts first before the help me questions. I'm running a stock unlimited Unlimited X JK. I just had a shop install my BB and all was fine for the first week. Today I bought the jeep into the dealship for the 15K checkup and they rotated and balanced tires. Driving around on errands I was on the highway and at high speed 55+ I hit a transition from one pavement to another (not done very well and more of a bump or speed bump) and I got the AKA DEATH WOBBLE.
Now I have not jumped under the jeep until the morning but I'm really not sure where to begin here. I'm going to probablly spend the whole day checking every possible torque on all bolts after I go get a torque wrench.
Here is what I'm thinking first and foremost and I need help to see if I'm missing anything.
1) Check the front toruque of all bolts
2) have backup person turn wheel and look for any loose parts AKA track bar and if there is any stress cracks in the stock front traction bar
3) go get the front wheels balanced again at dealship if possible (they only do stuff by appointment.
Now the questions:
1) I'm assuming the dealship balanced the tires correctly. In looking at the rims they all have very little weight on them. Is it possible the dealership did not do it right? I've scrolled through many posts so far and it seems t always point at getting re-balanced first.
2) Can someone post what a relocation bracket looks like on the jeep? I heard of one for the rear for the sway bar but I have yet to see a picture so I'm only imagining what this looks like and is doing. I'm a visual person more than able to understand via verbal discriptions.
3) Any other thoughts on this as this is my Daily driving vehicle and I'm not sure if I should be driving as this scared the piss outta me at 55+ MPH. 65 to be exact.
Now I have not jumped under the jeep until the morning but I'm really not sure where to begin here. I'm going to probablly spend the whole day checking every possible torque on all bolts after I go get a torque wrench.
Here is what I'm thinking first and foremost and I need help to see if I'm missing anything.
1) Check the front toruque of all bolts
2) have backup person turn wheel and look for any loose parts AKA track bar and if there is any stress cracks in the stock front traction bar
3) go get the front wheels balanced again at dealship if possible (they only do stuff by appointment.
Now the questions:
1) I'm assuming the dealship balanced the tires correctly. In looking at the rims they all have very little weight on them. Is it possible the dealership did not do it right? I've scrolled through many posts so far and it seems t always point at getting re-balanced first.
2) Can someone post what a relocation bracket looks like on the jeep? I heard of one for the rear for the sway bar but I have yet to see a picture so I'm only imagining what this looks like and is doing. I'm a visual person more than able to understand via verbal discriptions.
3) Any other thoughts on this as this is my Daily driving vehicle and I'm not sure if I should be driving as this scared the piss outta me at 55+ MPH. 65 to be exact.
Ok the solution to the problem is a combination of issues.
1) I took apart parts of the originally install of the BB and started over on the front side. I checked tourque as I performed the disassembly. The track bar was actually over torqued to about 140 ft lb and the drivers side lower bolt on the sway bar link (SBL) was torqued to 65 ft lbs so I assume this bolt loosened up after the install.
2) the ride still had a shimmy so I brought the jeep back to the dealership to have the front wheels re-balanced. I found out the only did a spin balance and not a road force balance as they could not do this. I paid 15 bucks and brought to Tire Discount to have them road for balance the tires. The difference between the spin balancing and the roadforace was pretty significant but I did not have the original weight count. I did see that the mark from the old weight from the road grim was 6 inches different. and the weight applied was double the size. 150 on one side and 150 on the back side of the rim.
Bottom line there is no real definition of what caused this. 2 1/2" should be fine according to the dealer but lifts are new to this model and we won't fully know until a little time passes. I explained I'm in no way concerned since folks here have had them on their vehicles for some time now and have seen no ill effects. (this is not the same dealership as the one that did the rotation of my tires)
Here is my hunch and it was confirmed with the garage that did the install. When the front track bar was reinstalled during the BB install the front track bar was not assembled on the ground nor does the instructions indicate this is supose to be the case. They had it on a lift and had the axle supported by a jack enough to align the bolt and tightened it then.
I read one post in this thread it should be tightened on the ground or the bearing could be torqued. I did it this way by installing the bolt and lowering the jack to the ground (after putting the tire back on) and it seemed to help quite a bit in the feel of the ride but I also had to tighten the other bolt as indicated in number 1 (SBL) so I can't say for sure.
I took the pictures from the instructions here and cropped them into 2 new pics with highlighting to explian the bolts in question. It seemed to help the feel and handling when installing as the track bar would be on the DD. I'll let the experts comment on it from here on out.
I also went over the section of the highway 7 times until I got pulled over. I was testing at 50 mph speed the same bump. I did this test before the tire rotation and I got an occassional shimmy at 65. (don't tell)
Last edited by NE Wrangling; 05-04-2009 at 10:22 AM.
12-28-2007, 06:30 PM
#25
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I want to say thank you to GRANT211 as your post is the overall install step not understood. I think is partially to blame for the issue along with over torqued bolts and lossened bolts and tires not roadforced balanced.
I do not see this on the instructions and the garage kind of confirmed they didn't do it this way as they had it on a lift held up by a jack so I believe while the jack probablly brought the axle up closer to when it's on the ground it is likely that it was not up all the way.
I believe this did not happen to me often but more than likely would of happened more frequently as time progressed.
I do not see this on the instructions and the garage kind of confirmed they didn't do it this way as they had it on a lift held up by a jack so I believe while the jack probablly brought the axle up closer to when it's on the ground it is likely that it was not up all the way.
I believe this did not happen to me often but more than likely would of happened more frequently as time progressed.
12-28-2007, 06:33 PM
#26
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I don't think you guys mean death wobble...that's a specific problem.
It sounds like most of the above are more like normal vibrations, like from tire imbalances, mis-alignments, etc.
Death wobble is like the rig is uncontrollable, darting left/right, etc.
Maybe some clarification on descriptive terms would help?
It sounds like most of the above are more like normal vibrations, like from tire imbalances, mis-alignments, etc.
Death wobble is like the rig is uncontrollable, darting left/right, etc.
Maybe some clarification on descriptive terms would help?
12-30-2007, 06:59 PM
#27
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ok still getting random shimmy or wobble minor this time at around 60 mph. Going in tomorrow for 3rd balancing (2nd road force). I did notice the jk unlimited steering stabilzer is very tiny compared to the rubicon and I'm wondering if this is a factor.
All bolts are full torqued, there appears to be no play in track bar nor stress cracks, tires have been balanced already. if tomorrows balancing yeilds no difference then I'm stumped. is this inefficent stabilzer causing some of this issue of poor feel.
It's not bumpsteer as when breaking and acceleration it is not turning it's only when I hit a bump.
hmmm, WOL do you have any thoughts? I know your on a snowboard somewhere but I hope you see this thread as I have no more solutions. centering in the front is only off by 1/8".
Also is it because I run my tires at 35psi?
All bolts are full torqued, there appears to be no play in track bar nor stress cracks, tires have been balanced already. if tomorrows balancing yeilds no difference then I'm stumped. is this inefficent stabilzer causing some of this issue of poor feel.
It's not bumpsteer as when breaking and acceleration it is not turning it's only when I hit a bump.
hmmm, WOL do you have any thoughts? I know your on a snowboard somewhere but I hope you see this thread as I have no more solutions. centering in the front is only off by 1/8".
Also is it because I run my tires at 35psi?
Last edited by NE Wrangling; 12-30-2007 at 07:09 PM.
01-02-2008, 07:51 PM
#28
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finally I fixed it
I can't believe all of the crap I went through.
I rechecked all the front torquing and found the track bar over tightened and installed incorrectly (not on the ground)
road forced balanced the wheels 2 times and elminated all the shimmy when just driving.
tonight I found the last but stupidest thing this aka 4 wheel expert screwed up in the rear. I kept getting a weird light wobble not in the steering wheel but in the actual body so I knew it was the rear. the idiot nevr put the links on the inside with stock tires. well he started to but only the top bolt on the drivers side. what the fudge? I fixed it all and took pictures because who knows what damage was done to the bushings. was torquing at an angle and when I hit bump on the highway at 65 it must of been screeming in pain!!! well please advise if I can write a buyer beware on these guys as they obviously haven't done many and only blamed the vaugue directions even though they kept telling me they love Teraflex and love to install their stuff. I should of been concerned when it took them 5 1/2 hrs to install and only charged me 170 bucks. All I can say is I smashed some wood to get out the anger. split like a madman as I took it all apart after finding this and re-installed the backend in 2 hrs including a 20 minute test run over the bump that causes my wobble/shimmy/1 time death wobble.
Thanks for patience and letting me vent. I'm still buying the next step through Teraflex with their adjustable tracks front and rear right after my stage 1 tires and rims. like I said in the beginning of this thread, I was trying to figure out what my problem was.
I rechecked all the front torquing and found the track bar over tightened and installed incorrectly (not on the ground)
road forced balanced the wheels 2 times and elminated all the shimmy when just driving.
tonight I found the last but stupidest thing this aka 4 wheel expert screwed up in the rear. I kept getting a weird light wobble not in the steering wheel but in the actual body so I knew it was the rear. the idiot nevr put the links on the inside with stock tires. well he started to but only the top bolt on the drivers side. what the fudge? I fixed it all and took pictures because who knows what damage was done to the bushings. was torquing at an angle and when I hit bump on the highway at 65 it must of been screeming in pain!!! well please advise if I can write a buyer beware on these guys as they obviously haven't done many and only blamed the vaugue directions even though they kept telling me they love Teraflex and love to install their stuff. I should of been concerned when it took them 5 1/2 hrs to install and only charged me 170 bucks. All I can say is I smashed some wood to get out the anger. split like a madman as I took it all apart after finding this and re-installed the backend in 2 hrs including a 20 minute test run over the bump that causes my wobble/shimmy/1 time death wobble.
Thanks for patience and letting me vent. I'm still buying the next step through Teraflex with their adjustable tracks front and rear right after my stage 1 tires and rims. like I said in the beginning of this thread, I was trying to figure out what my problem was.
Last edited by NE Wrangling; 01-02-2008 at 07:55 PM. Reason: mis spelling from pda
01-02-2008, 08:03 PM
#29
JK Junkie
I can't believe all of the crap I went through.
I rechecked all the front torquing and found the track bar over tightened and installed incorrectly (not on the ground)
road forced balanced the wheels 2 times and elminated all the shimmy when just driving.
tonight I found the last but stupidest thing this aka 4 wheel expert screwed up in the rear. I kept getting a weird light wobble not in the steering wheel but in the actual body so I knew it was the rear. the idiot nevr put the links on the inside with stock tires. well he started to but only the top bolt on the drivers side. what the fudge? I fixed it all and took pictures because who knows what damage was done to the bushings. was torquing at an angle and when I hit bump on the highway at 65 it must of been screeming in pain!!! well please advise if I can write a buyer beware on these guys as they obviously haven't done many and only blamed the vaugue directions even though they kept telling me they love Teraflex and love to install their stuff. I should of been concerned when it took them 5 1/2 hrs to install and only charged me 170 bucks. All I can say is I smashed some wood to get out the anger. split like a madman as I took it all apart after finding this and re-installed the backend in 2 hrs including a 20 minute test run over the bump that causes my wobble/shimmy/1 time death wobble.
Thanks for patience and letting me vent. I'm still buying the next step through Teraflex with their adjustable tracks front and rear right after my stage 1 tires and rims. like I said in the beginning of this thread, I was trying to figure out what my problem was.
I rechecked all the front torquing and found the track bar over tightened and installed incorrectly (not on the ground)
road forced balanced the wheels 2 times and elminated all the shimmy when just driving.
tonight I found the last but stupidest thing this aka 4 wheel expert screwed up in the rear. I kept getting a weird light wobble not in the steering wheel but in the actual body so I knew it was the rear. the idiot nevr put the links on the inside with stock tires. well he started to but only the top bolt on the drivers side. what the fudge? I fixed it all and took pictures because who knows what damage was done to the bushings. was torquing at an angle and when I hit bump on the highway at 65 it must of been screeming in pain!!! well please advise if I can write a buyer beware on these guys as they obviously haven't done many and only blamed the vaugue directions even though they kept telling me they love Teraflex and love to install their stuff. I should of been concerned when it took them 5 1/2 hrs to install and only charged me 170 bucks. All I can say is I smashed some wood to get out the anger. split like a madman as I took it all apart after finding this and re-installed the backend in 2 hrs including a 20 minute test run over the bump that causes my wobble/shimmy/1 time death wobble.
Thanks for patience and letting me vent. I'm still buying the next step through Teraflex with their adjustable tracks front and rear right after my stage 1 tires and rims. like I said in the beginning of this thread, I was trying to figure out what my problem was.
So the wobble you had was because of an improper install all along?! I can lay my TF BB worries to rest?
. Sorry that your problem was related to improper install. Give the shop a call and tell them, see what they say. If you're not satisfied with their response, report them to the BBB.
I know that wouldve drove me crazy too. Yet anoher reason why I do all my own wrenchin.