wayoflife

As you can see in these photos, my rear swaybar DID NOT prevent me from attaining maximum stuff....


nor did it prevent me from maximum droop...


If fact, what it did offer me was stability on an off-camber trail that has big rocks and one that sits next to a cliff. But hey, that's just me

RedneckJeep

But why the hell would anybody wanna be safe next to a cliff???

wayoflife

Yeah, my old CJ7 came with a front sway bar but honestly, I didn't see much of a difference with or without it connected on pavement. Of course, it had no rear but of course, it really isn't needed on a leaf spring setup.

seer1

I installed my OME 2" while dealing with the flu and 20-30 mph winds. First I will NEVER work on my JK again when I'm sick. When I was done, the Jeep handled like crap. Nowhere near the better than factory ride I had been expecting after reading the posts here. Two weeks later, I was feeling much better and crawled under to re-torque everything. Sure enough I hadn't tightened the left rear sway bar link. The stud had stripped from constant movement so I could only tighten the outer nut in until it is even with the end of the stud. I had to bring the inner nut out to get it tight. Amazing how much better a ride that little change made.

I know of folks who throw away their front sway bar when they get a new ride. I can't picture riding without the rear one. It throws the rear around all over the place for what I can see as minimal to no advantage.

Big D2

Great pics, Wayoflife.

Well, it looks like we're just having a discussion and not calling each other names. Thanks guys for this.

Ok, yes sway bars do offer stability, and yes I am doing this on my own opinion. But lets not take several things out of context.

A sway bar is a poor man's tool to fix a deficient suspension design. I agree with Wayoflife on this. Stiffer things are the only way to go. Many high performance suspensions tuning houses do exactly this. Minimal or no sway bar, plus a very high compression spring. Yes, I know this is performance cars, and yes I know this is a Jeep but physics are the same. I've had to pleasure to put a few V12 and a V8 supercharged vehicules on a skid pad test. Both had speed sensor sensitive sway bars that could be turned off. On both vehicules the behaviour was the same. With the sway off, the vehicule gave you feedback when it was about to break loose. Judging by the amount of lean, the driver is easily able to back of the throttle and not induce a spin. With the sways on their hardest setting, the handling is phenomenal. The problem is the driver does not get a feedback of when the back end will break loose. When you do approach a limit, there is nothing.The back end just snaps around completely, creating a violent departure from traction. Now, apparently our governments feel it is better to induce an oversteer in such a at the limit situation (I know almost all vehicules are setup with inherent understeers). So like I said, I know it's a Jeep but similar...and I repeat similar characteristics apply.

I feel that with the rear sway off (on road), I am better able to judge the speed and whether it's excessive for the given turn. I have to remind you, that I only have a mild lift with 34's. So there is a slight increase in CG but not as much as some guys here running with 4 or 6 inch lifts and 37's. I am running a BB, so yes you are correct it is slightly different than a full spring setup. No, it's impossible to unseat the spring in the current setup. The shock length does not allow it. I have not increased the suspension travel, it was merely moved slightly lower.

As for excessive speed on the trail, lets get real here. You know exactly what I mean. 4 lo in 1st or 2nd gear on the Rubicon aint no Baja 1000. I would never travel that fast on the trail unless the vehicule was setup to run it, and the trail was designated for high speed use ONLY. What I mean is that if you travel at 1-2 mph, you might be able to increase your speed to 3-4 mph. Over great distances, this is a significant amount of time that you could save.

Now, why do I like no rear sway on the trail. I guess it's just a poor mans fix for a softer ride. Why do we air down then? (I know traction but we're talking here about suspension and compliance).You could get exceptional stability with 45psi dual sways and really stiff suspension. With a tire difflated to single digits you are (relatively) increasing the max range of suspension travel and contact. I'm not sure if I'm wording this right but obviously with less air you'll get up higher up an RTI ramp. With less air, the tire works as part of the suspension, absorbing some of the impact, and hence, no sway, you're able to fully utilize the suspension travel. I guess the bonus here would be a multi rate or progressive spring as some manufactures offer.

Now, back to our onroad stuff. The most popular vehicule rollover test is the Elk or Moose (Hey Canada) test. I guarantee you that 95-100% of the lifted rigs here would fail this test. There is simply no reason why same old physics would not apply here. If you raise the CG, you must do something to counteract this. But as we all know, as soon as lift goes on, we get a nice yellow sitcker to put on the visor that says when we roll, it is because we were going to FAST! You can't sue anyone....lol...but, before I get side tracked, sways are put on a vehicule to make it more stable since putting the approriate springs would make all the regular polident users sue since their dentures would fall out. Hence, you could get the same effect with stiffer springs and no sway, or softer springs and bigger sways.

As for why, I took mine off. Well, I took them of to experiment with the handling dynamics of the vehicule both on and offroad. Yes, the rear sway is small so it does a little bit of a job but not as much as the front (that's why it's thicker). Yes, you're right it probably does not limit you to reaching full flex situations, and if you check my original post, I did state that it is much more balanced with the sway on. Basically, with the front discoed, the rear spring rate (+ torsional rigidity of the sway) comes very close to the fronts. I do like how much simpler to back end looks. Less stuff to get caught up on. Not just rocks, branches, and other items you might find on the trail.

So I thank everyone for a civilized discussion. It is afterall a personal opinion only. I don't recommend or condone doing this. If you do it, you might experience similar results, and whether you like them or not that's up to you. The rear (and front) sway bars are safety features put on manufactures to make the vehicules more stable both for regular driving as well as avoidance manoevers. So if you are unconfortable about doing a similar test, then leave them on.

Big D2

Now, for this you have done the absolute worst thing that can be done. One sway bar link connected is much worse and unstable than the hole bar off. I know that it was part of the install, but I'm sure the vehicule felt very unstable.

myklt8

Wow, a discussion, with differences of opinion, and no name calling, no "that's stupid", just calm rational discussion...what is this forum coming to?
Thanks for the info and the reasons behind the opinions, I wish all discussions would go this way

seer1

Yep absolutely the wrong thing here and even though I haven't called anybody names on this thread, I was sure calling myself some when I saw what I had(n't) done.

Although since that link's screwed up anyway, I'm taking a long look at that rear Currie kit now.

Now as far as the (it's deer/elk down here) test. Suck it up, steer straight, brake as best you can, call your insurance company and hope there's enough of the animal ungraveled so you can fill up the freezer. It's better than a roll over or a head-on with the other lane.

Northridge4x4

with coils springs you NEED a rear sway bar for the suspension to work as DESIGNED . If you want to take it off fine, But it is not helping you it is actually hurting your offroad ability by not having it.

David

Dante

What about installing a 2" BB and keeping the rear sway bar links (not getting extended links). Would that in anyway limit suspension travel/performance?