gnarly_mike

I mean I can stand some downtime but not over like a month or two max probably. I have a 2012. Do you mind me asking what you spent on the stock and joints and brackets? I'm trying to get an estimate of what I'd spend compared to something off the shelf. How'd you make sure the geometry was correct? It looks like you have ORIs or some kind of strut, I plan to run ORIs eventually, possibly, maybe coilovers though.

Invest2m4

It is definitely less expensive if you build it yourself. Brackets, joints, links, etc, is definitely under $2k. Geometry is an art and a science. There are several of us who have done similar builds and we all talk about the geometry in the build threads. Ultimately, you use a 4 link calculator. It really isn't very complicated. You save yourself a lot of time by starting with something that has already been done.

If I did it again, it would probably take 25% of the time as it did the first time. There was a ton of trial and error.

Yes, I'm running 16" ORIs all around. Build threads to look at are mine, Dirtman, Ringer (JK Freaks site), Maertz, and I think greatwhitejk (sp?) is one as well. There are more out there. Ringer's is good if you are keeping stock axles as that is what he did.

TheDirtman

Geometry is what most "kits" have going against them. They use factory brackets to keep things simple for the end user. Some will use drop brackets and drop pitman arms for steering which is slightly better then not using them but is a cheap easy way to go. When moving to a long arm "kits" will use new frame side brackets but typically locate those brackets for ease of install and clearance to things like frame and tires, not geometry. RK does some with their 3 link and the fact the upper link bracket is adjustable for some anti squat adjustment. Problem there is it is really high and limits up travel.

The real challenge is that you are trying to do an extreme suspension change on a chassis that is not built for it. Typically with a long arm to maintain geometry you are going to be cutting the frame or dropping the belly to get link separation and clearance for up travel.

As a rule of thumb (not set into stone) is that you use 25% of your tire height for link separation numbers. The axle side is pretty easy to get but the frame side becomes a challenge. The issue is leverage when you put power to the tires and the more separation you have in the links the stronger the set up is. Along with the separation is the length of the links and the orientation of those links.

Different lengths of the upper and lower links will cause the pinion angle to change thru the suspension travel. Rule of thumb is the uppers should be 80%+ of the length of the lowers. On mine I actually run the uppers just sliglhly longer then the lowers and my mount are near the rear output on the transfer case. This keeps my pinion angle pointing up at the transfer case thruout the entire suspension travel and I am not limited by the drive shaft with 16" of travel.

As far as orientation of the links, try and get the upper links as parallel to the ground as you can while the lowers should angle up from the axle to the frame. This triangle affect how the weight is transferred when accelerating or braking also know as anti-squat.

And while you are thinking about all this stuff most will forget about making the system easy to service like I did requiring me to remove the entire suspension and axles to change out my clutch. My current set up allows me to pull the transfer case and clutch without removing anything but a skid plate and a small cross member. The build thread is here The time has come.....TheDirtmans level 4 build...Ha!...ha!....ha!...cough!...cough!!
Its long so look at the last couple of pages for the latest updates.