Well, you just identified the problem. You are running STOCK control arms. There is NO adjustment to fix caster with stock control arms as they are a fixed length. I'm not sure what 4WD is telling you in regards to cams, unless maybe the added these?? That doesnt make sense to me at all though.

If they are telling you that the caster is "taken care of" then you need to ask them HOW and to what degree. As the target degree of caster is debatable. As BigBlue pointed out, WOL suggest 6*... Teraflex suggest 5*... Others suggest more, less, or in the middle. So, what does 4WD suggest? Keep in mind that stock caster is 4.2 +/- .5*. So, they may say it is in that range and call it "taken care of." Fact remains that when you lift a JK, the suggested caster increases from the stock parameters. My guess is that, since you cant adjust stock CA's, then they claim your caster is good because it is within the stock range. That is good for STOCK, but not for lifted.

You are being told to get adj CA's from guys here because it is the only way (besides longer/shorter fixed aftermarket CA's, or cams) to adjust to a more negative caster... which is almost a necessity when you lift over a "certain height." Here again, that "certain height" when this is required is debatable.

Tell 4WD, or another shop to set your caster at 5-6* and buy what you need to do that. You will be very happy you did. You have the adj front track bar coming that will allow you to recenter your front axle. As long as they are all set correctly, and all bolts are torqued properly, you will not have any problems.

You cant dis TF because they offer a mulititude of packages. Nearly all makes of lifts offer comparable packages. In some cases they are sufficient, in some cases they push things just barely over the line to affect the geometry enough to cause adverse results. You are the one who chose to save money and not buy a "complete package." I'm not bagging on you at all, and I think it was the right way to go to see if it would be "good enough." It obviously isnt, so see what else is the minumum you need to buy to give you the results you like. I understand how frustrated you are, like I said, I have been there a few times.

I do think you are getting the run around from the guys at the shop working on this. If you need to, PM me and I would be happy to give you my cell # and talk to them while you are at their shop... Or perhaps, somebody is in your area that can go with you... Or even better, maybe somebody will offer a better shop to take it to that knows better and/or wont give you the run around...

 

Check your toe-in, too much toe in will cause DW . I know, I know, I post this on every DW thread. But it's an easy thing to check and play with. If I run what is technically sound for 35's on my rig ( 1/8" toe in) I get DW hitting any bump. I currently run 1/16 toe-out. Maybe something to look at .

 

Oops, sorry... I was getting confused between the OP and Jeepersjeep... I guess what I posted was kind of combining the two.. Anyway, hope it helps.

Still, I dont think its fair to blame TF. You could have gotten numerous kits that do not offer CA's and had the same results. They are in a tough spot... People want a cheap kit, and to be able to get by with as few components as needed. Other people want to get more lift then what is advertised. Sometimes, that extra 1/4" of height is just enough to push it over the limit where other components are needed.

I understand where you are coming from, but I think you need to accept some of the blame for trying to get by with as little as possible. Why do you think there are kits out there that offer more complete kits? This is to dial things in tighter, and improve handling even more. Not to mention, the line that is drawn (somewhere between 2-3" of height) that REQUIRES additional components is a bit blurry. The height you probably got, must have been just barely over that line... Unless everything else is completely dialed and perfect, you can get adverse reactions... Just my .02...

 

This is a great point too... Not sure if I would suggest going toe-out, but this is what worked with this particular setup.

Things like your toe-in have much less margin of error once Jeeps are lifted. Where 1/8-1/4" in would prob be fine with a stock suspension, it can wreak havoc on a lifted suspension.

I believe there is a bit of art to this all. Not every Jeep is the exactly the same. In most cases they are "the same enough" but when you are on that fine line of not needing, or needing, addl components, these little things all add up...

 

That is all great advice, thankyou.
I belive in TF parts and quality just feel I get the runaround the two times I asked them for help, and like I said, it's nothing personal at all. thankyou for understanding.

 

Man, I COMPLETELY understand the level of frustrations it can take you to! Joe was very helpful for me in answering some questions and giving me some guidance...

 

I am a bit confused here... So because your Jeep could benefit from adj. track arms and control arms you feel that you were misinformed by the maker of the kit? Any kit that gives you that level of height is going to have the axle shift. when you have a track arm attached to the frame and the other end to the axle, as the jeep goes up the axle gets pulled over.

DO THIS: take a piece of paper and fold it into a Z. then I want you to move the bottom of the Z downward without shifting it over. It is impossible to keep the bottom and the top parallel without it moving side to side as it moves up and down. It is the design of that suspension system... not Teraflex's lift. You do not have to have an adj. track arm, but why wouldn't you want one??? I want my axle lined up perfect.

As far as the control arms go, I think almost any Jeep at any height could benefit from adj. control arms. At least lower fronts. When I had a 2" superlift my Jeep felt a little flighty, and wandered a bit. I thought that is just a super short wheelbase. That is how they drive. Now my jeep tracks down the road perfectly. I can drive it with one finger. There is no walking or "flighty" or light feeling. none. It feels connected to the road, and it handles fantastic. If you were put in my jeep without knowing how tall it was and the tire size you would swear it was stock.

When you bought the teraflex kit did you not see that that very kit came in many configurations? It sounds like you bought the least expensive version of the kit. There is nothing wrong with that, but I think it is naive to expect top notch performance from a lifted vehicle when you purchased the minimum. There are many kits out there (many with more advertised height) that come with less than this kit does, and the companies that make them call them complete. IMO lifting a vehicle 3" or more is extreme. I know in a world of long arm kits and coilovers that it does not sound like much, but you are changing a lot of geometry. I don't really understand how people can expect to take a vehicle designed to be X height and just add a 3"+ taller spring and expect it to still drive the same. Look at the kits Rough country and others are selling as complete and compare them to the Teraflex kit and see just how very complete that kit is. It is a better product too.

I hate to say this... BUT.... many people are running setups similar to yours. Cam-bolts and all. and not getting Death wobble. I don't think that the problem is the lift kit, or even a lack of caster. Maybe it is... either way, I would add some adj. control arms. I think when it is said and done the problem is going to be an install issue.

 

Sorry to HiJack your thread Ryan. I'll keep you all updated.
And thankyou all for the awsome suggestions.

 

HAHA, no problem. This has been a good discussion.

 

New trackbar arrived Friday from Teraflex and is now installed. It helped my Death Wobble just the slightest bit but didn't fix the problem. I am glad I purchased it cause its bada**. This thing is way nice.
Now I'm on to replacing the stabilizer, then the lower control arms.
I've got the LCA's but want to replace stabilizer first.






Looks like a shotgun.




FYI had to adjust it out 9/16th longer than the stock TB, measures 33" center of hole to center