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Can't stop my death wobble

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Old 04-26-2014 | 10:14 PM
  #11  
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If you only get wobble at highway speeds, it could be your alignment - The toe-in being off by 1/8" can cause issues. Get it aligned to a perfect 1/16th inch and see. That solved my issue... And it was a very serious vehicle shaking, tire screeching wobble which caused me to have to slow down to less than 30 MPH before it would stop
Old 04-26-2014 | 10:46 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by prdufresne
Before I start, I want to thank Panman for his write-ups and videos on the subject. They helped me a great deal. Despite Panman's contributions, I still haven't solved my death wobble issues. I've been at it for a while, but I can't figure this out! I recently replaced my 2007 JKU Sahara (which my son destroyed in an accident), with a 2008 JKU Rubicon. I installed a 3.5" Rubicon Express lift, which includes an adjustable trackbar, so that I could fit the 35" tires I was able to salvage from my old JKU. Everything seemed to be fine, but then I started experiencing some wobbles. So, I started trying to diagnose and solve the issue. Here's what I've done so far to try to resolve the issue[*]loosened, settled and retightened all of my control arms.[*]Replaced all four tie rod ends (with Moog ends), as they all displayed vertical movement while running the checklist[*]Replaced the trackbar bolts with 9/16" bolts with a shoulder, torqued them to 125ft/lbs[*]Checked my tire pressure. Both sides are at 32psi After replacing all the tie rod ends, I went back through the checklist and I still had a clunk. It's most noticeable at the pitman arm end of the drag link, and seems to be coming from the steering box. I'm trying to get it in for a front end alignment tomorrow, but based on my measurements, the axle is centered within a 1/4" and the steering wheel is centered, but I think my tires might be toed in a little too much. When I installed the lift, I didn't install the cam bolts as my drive shafts were nicely aligned, but I think I may need to install them to allow the castor to be adjusted properly. Will an alignment solve my problem, or am I looking at a new steering box? ThanX!
Thanks.

If you are running a 3.5" lift on stock arms, you have too little caster. This, combined with too much toe-in will cause problems. So, get front lower adjustable arms to fix caster and set your toe-in to no more than 1/8".

Do this, and fix the source of the clunk, and it sounds like you have solved your source(s), as long as you did everything else in the written checklist.
Old 04-27-2014 | 05:37 AM
  #13  
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I was able to get my JKU in for an alignment yesterday, and there is no more death wobble, even hitting large bumps. I wasn't able to get the final alignment numbers, as I picked up my Jeep after the service centre had closed, but I'll ask on Monday.

I do know, however, that my tires were toed in too much, by quite a bit and my castor was off a little and they only centered the axle very slightly. This based on the voicemail he left me.

Tires are balanced, and I did rotter them when I installed them on the new rig. The ball joints don't have any play that I can see and my unit bearings appear fine based on running through planman's checklist.

Death wobble appears to be gone, but in still get some bump steer, but nothing major.
Old 04-27-2014 | 05:38 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by ShakyJake
Terrible advice. Fix the underlying problem or face bigger problem or injury down the road.
Well thanks grand wizard.
Yet no one could fix my DW. No advice from here. Not the dealer. Not the 4 wheel shop that did my suspension. I tried so many things and swapped out so much stuff.
So I just should have kept my DW? No I've had it taken care by this "terrible advice" for 3 years minus the time the stabilizer went out.
When does the bigger problem come? And if it does get bigger won't it then at least show what was the cause? Even after 3 years I am wondering if it ever will show.
So my advice to the OP is to do whatever will help, regardless of the peanut gallery.
Old 04-27-2014 | 07:40 AM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by Wgrin
Well thanks grand wizard.
Yet no one could fix my DW. No advice from here. Not the dealer. Not the 4 wheel shop that did my suspension. I tried so many things and swapped out so much stuff.
So I just should have kept my DW? No I've had it taken care by this "terrible advice" for 3 years minus the time the stabilizer went out.
When does the bigger problem come? And if it does get bigger won't it then at least show what was the cause? Even after 3 years I am wondering if it ever will show.
So my advice to the OP is to do whatever will help, regardless of the peanut gallery.
No need to get huffy. It is well known that a SS does not fix DW. It can help with other vibrations, but DW is different. There's a reason for the word death in the description. If you truly experienced it, you would not advise anyone to temporarily mask it.

Last edited by ShakyJake; 04-27-2014 at 07:45 AM.
Old 04-27-2014 | 07:55 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Wgrin
Well thanks grand wizard. Yet no one could fix my DW. No advice from here. Not the dealer. Not the 4 wheel shop that did my suspension. I tried so many things and swapped out so much stuff. So I just should have kept my DW? No I've had it taken care by this "terrible advice" for 3 years minus the time the stabilizer went out. When does the bigger problem come? And if it does get bigger won't it then at least show what was the cause? Even after 3 years I am wondering if it ever will show. So my advice to the OP is to do whatever will help, regardless of the peanut gallery.
In the last 4 years, with as many as 92,000 views on each of the forums where I have posted my Diagnosing DW threads, not one person has been unable to diagnose and fix their DW using my written inspection checklist.

How many times did you perform each and every one of the steps in my inspection checklist?
Old 04-27-2014 | 08:21 AM
  #17  
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Did I? I won't lie and say I did that whole checklist at that point I knew enough to change the oil.
I did read your post back then a dozen times in hopes I'd absorb it via osmosis.
I changed out the bolts because of your post but that was my level of ability.
However I did not have anyone to assist me either and I was getting freaked out when my jeep started to feel like someone threw it in the dryer and hit tumble dry.
The best I could do was "relay" your thoughts to the shop trying to help me. All they started doing each time I brought it in (4 wheel parts) was try another alignment and balance or another stabilizer. After changing control arms and trac bar.
You probably gave me ideas from my own DW thread back then.
When it came back this time I was told and I did see my shock bushings had gone. 4 wheel parts told me that I should replace them but that was not the reason it had come back.
4 wheel parts is not up here since I moved away from TX so this was via phone calls.
Goodyear is the best I have up here and the guy checked all the fittings and everything was solid.
4 wheel parts told me to take off the stabilizer and see if it had gone bad and it had.
So I put a new one on and it went away again.
All I know is that with a pressurized stabilizer it has let me drive my jeep that otherwise I was unable to; when no one else physically was able to help me.
I started my original reply stating that I knew a stabilizer wouldn't fix the issue.
I implied that if you do not get it fixed--as no one was able to for me--then that option allowed me to drive.
Old 04-27-2014 | 09:49 AM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Wgrin
Did I? I won't lie and say I did that whole checklist at that point I knew enough to change the oil. I did read your post back then a dozen times in hopes I'd absorb it via osmosis. I changed out the bolts because of your post but that was my level of ability. However I did not have anyone to assist me either and I was getting freaked out when my jeep started to feel like someone threw it in the dryer and hit tumble dry. The best I could do was "relay" your thoughts to the shop trying to help me. All they started doing each time I brought it in (4 wheel parts) was try another alignment and balance or another stabilizer. After changing control arms and trac bar. You probably gave me ideas from my own DW thread back then. When it came back this time I was told and I did see my shock bushings had gone. 4 wheel parts told me that I should replace them but that was not the reason it had come back. 4 wheel parts is not up here since I moved away from TX so this was via phone calls. Goodyear is the best I have up here and the guy checked all the fittings and everything was solid. 4 wheel parts told me to take off the stabilizer and see if it had gone bad and it had. So I put a new one on and it went away again. All I know is that with a pressurized stabilizer it has let me drive my jeep that otherwise I was unable to; when no one else physically was able to help me. I started my original reply stating that I knew a stabilizer wouldn't fix the issue. I implied that if you do not get it fixed--as no one was able to for me--then that option allowed me to drive.
Rock Krawler is in the Albany area.

I made the videos for people who are new to working in their jeeps.

A 3.25" lift needs adjustable front lower control arms to set your caster alignment spec. It requires an adjustable front trackbar to center the front axle.

It required loosening all control arm and trackbar bolts for the install, and to wait until the full weight of the vehicle was back on the ground at the new ride height to ensure that the bushings are pinched between the brackets in a neutral position instead of binding/twisted/pre-loaded to the wrong ride height.

Bad wobbles will result in premature failure of the knuckle side of the drag link.

It isn't uncommon for bad wobbles to prematurely wear out lower ball joints.

If you are masking steering feedback of bad drag link ends, bad ball joints, too low caster, twisted control arm and trackbar bushings, etc., with a HD steering stabilizer, you won't feel the excessive wear in those other components until a severe, or even catastrophic failure.

For example some other who have taken your approach have ended up with a trackbar bracket completely ripped off the frame or axle, while driving at speed, with almost a complete loss of ability to steer.

Last edited by planman; 04-27-2014 at 10:11 AM.
Old 04-27-2014 | 10:22 AM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by planman
Rock Krawler is in the Albany area.

I made the videos for people who are new to working in their jeeps.

A 3.25" lift needs adjustable front lower control arms to set your caster alignment spec. It requires an adjustable front trackbar to center the front axle.

It required loosening all control arm and trackbar bolts for the install, and to wait until the full weight of the vehicle was back on the ground at the new ride height to ensure that the bushings are pinched between the brackets in a neutral position instead of binding/twisted/pre-loaded to the wrong ride height.

Bad wobbles will result in premature failure of the knuckle side of the drag link.

It isn't uncommon for bad wobbles to prematurely wear out lower ball joints.

If you are masking steering feedback of bad drag link ends, bad ball joints, too low caster, twisted control arm and trackbar bushings, etc., with a HD steering stabilizer, you won't feel the excessive wear in those other components until a severe, or even catastrophic failure.

For example some other who have taken your approach have ended up with a trackbar bracket completely ripped off the frame or axle, while driving at speed, with almost a complete loss of ability to steer.
I did the measure with loosening and waiting to retighten.
I am about 4-4.5 hrs from Albany, sadly the closest place that I have found up here in the top is in Canada, and that is about 3 hours away. There are a lot of clubs up here, seems like someone could be making a killing if they opened up a shop. Most people up here are the do-it-yourself type from the lack of professionals.
I am moving back down to the Oklahoma region, end of next year, and will plan on changing out the BJs just to be safe. If my jeep breaks, it breaks. Not to sound all Ivan Drago (Rocky IV) but I put too much time/stress/money into it to continue the stress over. I thought of taking off the lift and even putting a new one that had LCA instead.
It's the stick a fork in me I am done. When it was occurring I was at the point of just wanting to get rid of the jeep it was so stressful.




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