Benefits of Coil Over Suspension vs Standard Coil Spring Set Up
12-06-2013, 07:30 AM
#11
JK Freak
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Thanks for all of the replies. I'm new to the Jeep so I can't tell you everything I will be doing in it, as I am just in the purchasing process. I just don't like spending money 2 or 3 times when I can just get the right set up the first time. That is why I asked everyones opinion because I figured most of you have been there and done that. Right now, I see my wife driving the Jeep most of the time for the next 1-2 years and then it will become a toy only and not be daily driven. She wants it fixed up some and to look better than they do stock. Most of it's time for the next year or so will be spent on road with some weekend excursions and trail driving. I don't see any high speed off road in my future because I live in Oklahoma and we don't really have that. I also have a Ford Raptor and I run into the same thing with there not being any high speed areas in Oklahoma. That's part of why I want the Jeep as well. Something that I can take my two young boys out in and do some trail riding, or take it to Colorado on some trails. We are planning a vacation to CO next summer so I would like to have some things done to it before we go. I will be running 37" tires along with the 3.5" lift and flat fenders so I know I need to look at gears as well. Those of you with this type of set up, would you be comfortable with your wife daily driving the Jeep on 37's? I'm sorry for all of the questions, I just want to try and make the most educated decision I can. Thanks again for your help and time.
12-06-2013, 07:34 AM
#12
JK Jedi
Its your money but it sound like you have big jeep envy. Dropping that kind of money and work to have your wife drive the kids to school makes no sense. It is you jeep and your money. For running trails your jeep is already set up to run just about anything that does not involve boulders or cliffs.
Some flat fenders, some front 3/4" leveling pucks and some decent shocks with some 35's will give your jeep a pretty good luck without replacing the entire suspension and dropping the fuel economy down into the 12-18 range. It truly just amazes me how many people pick up a new jeep and immediately think they need to run a 37"-40" tire on it to drive around on a dirt road.
Some flat fenders, some front 3/4" leveling pucks and some decent shocks with some 35's will give your jeep a pretty good luck without replacing the entire suspension and dropping the fuel economy down into the 12-18 range. It truly just amazes me how many people pick up a new jeep and immediately think they need to run a 37"-40" tire on it to drive around on a dirt road.
Last edited by TheDirtman; 12-06-2013 at 08:51 AM.
12-06-2013, 07:44 AM
#13
I went with coil overs thinking it would be the most bitchin thing in the world. (And it is) But so far there have been many issues. First,, King sold me the shocks with the complete wrong springs ( WAY TOO STIFF),, and they wont give you the correct springs, you will have to buy them! King is also no help at all in assisting with tuning the shocks, so you need someone with that knowledge. Second, they aren't exactly street friendly,, or at least as I have them set now. I am still trying to get the set up right, when I think it should have been at least close when purchased from king.
The reason I went CO is because I was moving my axels out, so I was cutting off the spring perches anyway.
If I were you,, and not relocating suspension, I would go with a Quality dual rate spring and match it up with a King or Fox internal bypass shock. Off Road Evolution has all the info you need, and they have supposedly perfected the valving on the Bypass.
Trust me when I tell you that a quality bypass shock will be well worth the money and will blow your mind when hauling ass!!!
The reason I went CO is because I was moving my axels out, so I was cutting off the spring perches anyway.
If I were you,, and not relocating suspension, I would go with a Quality dual rate spring and match it up with a King or Fox internal bypass shock. Off Road Evolution has all the info you need, and they have supposedly perfected the valving on the Bypass.
Trust me when I tell you that a quality bypass shock will be well worth the money and will blow your mind when hauling ass!!!
lol... direct him away from expensive COs, only to point him at even more expensive shocks!?! Why not combine the two.... I know that is what EVO will try and sell him.
Coilovers are hit and miss, as every rig is different. While a company might be able to get a close spring rate, they'll likely never get it right the first time. Everyone I know with COs has at least three sets of coils hanging in their shop.... those were the ones they were tuning through til they found the right spring rate. So when a customer calls up and orders, a spring rate is set, if it's the wrong one, the customer must purchase another and another till it comes out right. On top of rigs being different (weight, balance, etc), you have driver preference. Some guys like it soft, some like it stiff and some even like the in and out rate to be different.... different strokes. On top of all that.... do you understand enough how a vehicle works to reconize the differences and nuances in the way one spring rate works over another?
As for King not being helpful.... a buddy of mine is running them on his JK. He told me that King has a program to tune the customer's shocks on a short course they have ('infield tuning' on their website). I am pretty positive he said it was free, but don't hold me to that. Not sure if other companies do that or not, but it looks like you are in SoCal... maybe give them a call and ask about this program? IDK about you... but even if they charge, it would seem a great service to tune with if you aren't a pro at it.
And as for the almighty god having the valving perfected.... come on, you don't think you can't take those numbers, call King or your favorite reseller and have them order with that valving or spring rates? It's no secret sauce EVO has, just good marketing parlayed into a store (ahem... forum) designed by Kim Jong Il himself.
Now... on to the OP. The real question you should ask yourself is why do you want to spend all this money? You claim you are looking for a nice riding rig that will not be run hard. Seems you (and I'd gather 98% of JK owners) are the perfect canadate for a budget boost and 35" tires. Great stance, decent performance, factory ride. I am pretty sure you are looking for those three things, no?
So... some might have you purchase $18,000 in suspension upgrades (don't quote me on that number as I believe it is far north of there, but a buddy of mine had WOG and EVO give him the full Project Gay-K (double shit down, triple bypasses, etc, etc, etc... a good screwing if you ask me. Nice Jeep for sure, but why is it setup like a trophy truck?). A rig that can handle 98% of what that high dollar build can do, can be had for around 1500 (BB, tires, install).
Unfortunatly, I do not have a money tree growing on my backyard... so I have to budget what I have. As far as I am concerned... having 16k left over for beer, women, or even college tution for the kids seems like a big win! And guess what... you'll still have a blast in that Jeep of yours.
Enjoy your Jeep.
12-06-2013, 07:46 AM
#14
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Attachment 514927
lol... direct him away from expensive COs, only to point him at even more expensive shocks!?! Why not combine the two.... I know that is what EVO will try and sell him.
Coilovers are hit and miss, as every rig is different. While a company might be able to get a close spring rate, they'll likely never get it right the first time. Everyone I know with COs has at least three sets of coils hanging in their shop.... those were the ones they were tuning through til they found the right spring rate. So when a customer calls up and orders, a spring rate is set, if it's the wrong one, the customer must purchase another and another till it comes out right. On top of rigs being different (weight, balance, etc), you have driver preference. Some guys like it soft, some like it stiff and some even like the in and out rate to be different.... different strokes. On top of all that.... do you understand enough how a vehicle works to reconize the differences and nuances in the way one spring rate works over another?
As for King not being helpful.... a buddy of mine is running them on his JK. He told me that King has a program to tune the customer's shocks on a short course they have ('infield tuning' on their website). I am pretty positive he said it was free, but don't hold me to that. Not sure if other companies do that or not, but it looks like you are in SoCal... maybe give them a call and ask about this program? IDK about you... but even if they charge, it would seem a great service to tune with if you aren't a pro at it.
And as for the almighty god having the valving perfected.... come on, you don't think you can't take those numbers, call King or your favorite reseller and have them order with that valving or spring rates? It's no secret sauce EVO has, just good marketing parlayed into a store (ahem... forum) designed by Kim Jong Il himself.
Now... on to the OP. The real question you should ask yourself is why do you want to spend all this money? You claim you are looking for a nice riding rig that will not be run hard. Seems you (and I'd gather 98% of JK owners) are the perfect canadate for a budget boost and 35" tires. Great stance, decent performance, factory ride. I am pretty sure you are looking for those three things, no?
So... some might have you purchase $18,000 in suspension upgrades (don't quote me on that number as I believe it is far north of there, but a buddy of mine had WOG and EVO give him the full Project Gay-K (double shit down, triple bypasses, etc, etc, etc... a good screwing if you ask me. Nice Jeep for sure, but why is it setup like a trophy truck?). A rig that can handle 98% of what that high dollar build can do, can be had for around 1500 (BB, tires, install).
Unfortunatly, I do not have a money tree growing on my backyard... so I have to budget what I have. As far as I am concerned... having 16k left over for beer, women, or even college tution for the kids seems like a big win! And guess what... you'll still have a blast in that Jeep of yours.
Enjoy your Jeep.
lol... direct him away from expensive COs, only to point him at even more expensive shocks!?! Why not combine the two.... I know that is what EVO will try and sell him.
Coilovers are hit and miss, as every rig is different. While a company might be able to get a close spring rate, they'll likely never get it right the first time. Everyone I know with COs has at least three sets of coils hanging in their shop.... those were the ones they were tuning through til they found the right spring rate. So when a customer calls up and orders, a spring rate is set, if it's the wrong one, the customer must purchase another and another till it comes out right. On top of rigs being different (weight, balance, etc), you have driver preference. Some guys like it soft, some like it stiff and some even like the in and out rate to be different.... different strokes. On top of all that.... do you understand enough how a vehicle works to reconize the differences and nuances in the way one spring rate works over another?
As for King not being helpful.... a buddy of mine is running them on his JK. He told me that King has a program to tune the customer's shocks on a short course they have ('infield tuning' on their website). I am pretty positive he said it was free, but don't hold me to that. Not sure if other companies do that or not, but it looks like you are in SoCal... maybe give them a call and ask about this program? IDK about you... but even if they charge, it would seem a great service to tune with if you aren't a pro at it.
And as for the almighty god having the valving perfected.... come on, you don't think you can't take those numbers, call King or your favorite reseller and have them order with that valving or spring rates? It's no secret sauce EVO has, just good marketing parlayed into a store (ahem... forum) designed by Kim Jong Il himself.
Now... on to the OP. The real question you should ask yourself is why do you want to spend all this money? You claim you are looking for a nice riding rig that will not be run hard. Seems you (and I'd gather 98% of JK owners) are the perfect canadate for a budget boost and 35" tires. Great stance, decent performance, factory ride. I am pretty sure you are looking for those three things, no?
So... some might have you purchase $18,000 in suspension upgrades (don't quote me on that number as I believe it is far north of there, but a buddy of mine had WOG and EVO give him the full Project Gay-K (double shit down, triple bypasses, etc, etc, etc... a good screwing if you ask me. Nice Jeep for sure, but why is it setup like a trophy truck?). A rig that can handle 98% of what that high dollar build can do, can be had for around 1500 (BB, tires, install).
Unfortunatly, I do not have a money tree growing on my backyard... so I have to budget what I have. As far as I am concerned... having 16k left over for beer, women, or even college tution for the kids seems like a big win! And guess what... you'll still have a blast in that Jeep of yours.
Enjoy your Jeep.
12-06-2013, 07:49 AM
#15
Forum Tech Advisor
Thanks for all of the replies. I'm new to the Jeep so I can't tell you everything I will be doing in it, as I am just in the purchasing process. I just don't like spending money 2 or 3 times when I can just get the right set up the first time. That is why I asked everyones opinion because I figured most of you have been there and done that. Right now, I see my wife driving the Jeep most of the time for the next 1-2 years and then it will become a toy only and not be daily driven. She wants it fixed up some and to look better than they do stock. Most of it's time for the next year or so will be spent on road with some weekend excursions and trail driving. I don't see any high speed off road in my future because I live in Oklahoma and we don't really have that. I also have a Ford Raptor and I run into the same thing with there not being any high speed areas in Oklahoma. That's part of why I want the Jeep as well. Something that I can take my two young boys out in and do some trail riding, or take it to Colorado on some trails. We are planning a vacation to CO next summer so I would like to have some things done to it before we go. I will be running 37" tires along with the 3.5" lift and flat fenders so I know I need to look at gears as well. Those of you with this type of set up, would you be comfortable with your wife daily driving the Jeep on 37's? I'm sorry for all of the questions, I just want to try and make the most educated decision I can. Thanks again for your help and time.
You can accomplish everything you want with a 2.5" lift, flat flares, rear fender well pinch seam trimming, regear, bumpers, winch, CB, a bag with recovery straps and d-rings, and the 37s on 4.5" or less backspaced wheels. It will handle well on and off road, be easier to maintain, be easier for the wife to drive, etc.
My wife has a 4 dr Rubi that is supercharged, sitting on EVO coilovers and rear EVOLever, with Teraflex long arms and 37s, with 5.38 gears. It is way overkill for her. She likes expedition type wheeling and lives her jeep in town and in the snow. She would have been fine with a 2.5" lift and flat flares on 35s, and there is nothing she's driven that she couldn't do with that setup.
Of course, I've taken her jeep over obstacles where her setup was barely enough, but that's another story.
My 2dr Rubi on 40s, supercharged, with Dana 60s, and what is the equivalent of a Rock Krawler 3.5" long arm, with Fox adjustable shocks, and 5.38s with ARB lockers is meant to be the rig that risks body damage and rollovers, not hers.
Mine would benefit from coilovers if I wanted more than 12" shock travel or decided to stretch the wheelbase more than I have already. 12" shock travel is quite a bit on a JK.
Do you want to be able to follow rock buggies, or do more expedition type offroading?
12-06-2013, 07:56 AM
#16
Former Vendor
I am trying to understand the benefits of going to a coil over system vs. a standard coil spring set up. I'm considering the EVO MFG Bolt On Coil Over set up vs. their coil spring set up or Rock Krawlers 3.5" X-Factor system. If I did the standard coil spring set up, I would run a nice King or Fox remote reservoir shock.
I am new to a Jeep and will be looking for great on-road characteristics (great ride/drive quality) and then the ability to hit the trails on the weekend. I don't know how much rock crawling I will do, I'm more looking for taking my two young's boys out on trails and just playing.
Any help on I can get on better understanding the benefits of one over the other and why you would have me go with one of those systems over the other. Thanks for the help!
I am new to a Jeep and will be looking for great on-road characteristics (great ride/drive quality) and then the ability to hit the trails on the weekend. I don't know how much rock crawling I will do, I'm more looking for taking my two young's boys out on trails and just playing.
Any help on I can get on better understanding the benefits of one over the other and why you would have me go with one of those systems over the other. Thanks for the help!
RK
Last edited by Rock Krawler Suspension; 12-06-2013 at 08:13 AM.
12-06-2013, 07:56 AM
#17
JK Jedi
Attachment 514927
lol... direct him away from expensive COs, only to point him at even more expensive shocks!?! Why not combine the two.... I know that is what EVO will try and sell him.
Coilovers are hit and miss, as every rig is different. While a company might be able to get a close spring rate, they'll likely never get it right the first time. Everyone I know with COs has at least three sets of coils hanging in their shop.... those were the ones they were tuning through til they found the right spring rate. So when a customer calls up and orders, a spring rate is set, if it's the wrong one, the customer must purchase another and another till it comes out right. On top of rigs being different (weight, balance, etc), you have driver preference. Some guys like it soft, some like it stiff and some even like the in and out rate to be different.... different strokes. On top of all that.... do you understand enough how a vehicle works to reconize the differences and nuances in the way one spring rate works over another?
As for King not being helpful.... a buddy of mine is running them on his JK. He told me that King has a program to tune the customer's shocks on a short course they have ('infield tuning' on their website). I am pretty positive he said it was free, but don't hold me to that. Not sure if other companies do that or not, but it looks like you are in SoCal... maybe give them a call and ask about this program? IDK about you... but even if they charge, it would seem a great service to tune with if you aren't a pro at it.
And as for the almighty god having the valving perfected.... come on, you don't think you can't take those numbers, call King or your favorite reseller and have them order with that valving or spring rates? It's no secret sauce EVO has, just good marketing parlayed into a store (ahem... forum) designed by Kim Jong Il himself.
Now... on to the OP. The real question you should ask yourself is why do you want to spend all this money? You claim you are looking for a nice riding rig that will not be run hard. Seems you (and I'd gather 98% of JK owners) are the perfect canadate for a budget boost and 35" tires. Great stance, decent performance, factory ride. I am pretty sure you are looking for those three things, no?
So... some might have you purchase $18,000 in suspension upgrades (don't quote me on that number as I believe it is far north of there, but a buddy of mine had WOG and EVO give him the full Project Gay-K (double shit down, triple bypasses, etc, etc, etc... a good screwing if you ask me. Nice Jeep for sure, but why is it setup like a trophy truck?). A rig that can handle 98% of what that high dollar build can do, can be had for around 1500 (BB, tires, install).
Unfortunatly, I do not have a money tree growing on my backyard... so I have to budget what I have. As far as I am concerned... having 16k left over for beer, women, or even college tution for the kids seems like a big win! And guess what... you'll still have a blast in that Jeep of yours.
Enjoy your Jeep.
lol... direct him away from expensive COs, only to point him at even more expensive shocks!?! Why not combine the two.... I know that is what EVO will try and sell him.
Coilovers are hit and miss, as every rig is different. While a company might be able to get a close spring rate, they'll likely never get it right the first time. Everyone I know with COs has at least three sets of coils hanging in their shop.... those were the ones they were tuning through til they found the right spring rate. So when a customer calls up and orders, a spring rate is set, if it's the wrong one, the customer must purchase another and another till it comes out right. On top of rigs being different (weight, balance, etc), you have driver preference. Some guys like it soft, some like it stiff and some even like the in and out rate to be different.... different strokes. On top of all that.... do you understand enough how a vehicle works to reconize the differences and nuances in the way one spring rate works over another?
As for King not being helpful.... a buddy of mine is running them on his JK. He told me that King has a program to tune the customer's shocks on a short course they have ('infield tuning' on their website). I am pretty positive he said it was free, but don't hold me to that. Not sure if other companies do that or not, but it looks like you are in SoCal... maybe give them a call and ask about this program? IDK about you... but even if they charge, it would seem a great service to tune with if you aren't a pro at it.
And as for the almighty god having the valving perfected.... come on, you don't think you can't take those numbers, call King or your favorite reseller and have them order with that valving or spring rates? It's no secret sauce EVO has, just good marketing parlayed into a store (ahem... forum) designed by Kim Jong Il himself.
Now... on to the OP. The real question you should ask yourself is why do you want to spend all this money? You claim you are looking for a nice riding rig that will not be run hard. Seems you (and I'd gather 98% of JK owners) are the perfect canadate for a budget boost and 35" tires. Great stance, decent performance, factory ride. I am pretty sure you are looking for those three things, no?
So... some might have you purchase $18,000 in suspension upgrades (don't quote me on that number as I believe it is far north of there, but a buddy of mine had WOG and EVO give him the full Project Gay-K (double shit down, triple bypasses, etc, etc, etc... a good screwing if you ask me. Nice Jeep for sure, but why is it setup like a trophy truck?). A rig that can handle 98% of what that high dollar build can do, can be had for around 1500 (BB, tires, install).
Unfortunatly, I do not have a money tree growing on my backyard... so I have to budget what I have. As far as I am concerned... having 16k left over for beer, women, or even college tution for the kids seems like a big win! And guess what... you'll still have a blast in that Jeep of yours.
Enjoy your Jeep.
To the op youve got in my opinion 3 of the best guys tellling you great info. Hell i could use coilovers and still didnt. I should have, but again were dealing with stretching and all that, where a coilover would be easier. A whole different level. I have 12" of travel i am using for significantly less than coilovers and its very capable. I also dd mine and it seems fine. For your plans i have to agree with them seems overkill. Even on a budget boost i think youd be surprised what you can do.
Last edited by Maertz; 12-06-2013 at 07:59 AM.
12-06-2013, 08:42 AM
#18
JK Super Freak
For running trails your jeep is already set up to run just about anything that does not involve holders or cliffs.
Some flat fenders, some front 3/4" leveling pucks and some decent shocks with some 35's will give your jeep a pretty good luck without replacing the entire suspension and dropping the fuel economy down into the 12-18 range. It truly just amazes me how many people pick up a new jeep and immediately think they need to run a 37"-40" tire on it to drive around on a dirt road.
Some flat fenders, some front 3/4" leveling pucks and some decent shocks with some 35's will give your jeep a pretty good luck without replacing the entire suspension and dropping the fuel economy down into the 12-18 range. It truly just amazes me how many people pick up a new jeep and immediately think they need to run a 37"-40" tire on it to drive around on a dirt road.
12-06-2013, 08:54 AM
#19
JK Jedi
If are planning on making this a toy in a couple years it only makes sense to wait to go to 37" tires. Running a soft compound mud terrain tire as a daily driver for a couple years and they will be worn out for off roading. You would need new tires anyway.
12-06-2013, 09:34 AM
#20
JK Newbie
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Thanks to everyone that posted. I think I will just do the standard coil spring lift and a nice shock. I really appreciate all of your help and your post definitely made sense in regards to the coil overs.
The Jeep expeditions are more of what I would like to do.
Thanks again!
The Jeep expeditions are more of what I would like to do.
Thanks again!