jim07x

This is not about wether or not I should have gotten the ticket.

"operated motor vehicle after taking off factory doors" was what the officer wrote under "Other" & checking off "Violated 67 PA code 175.80"

This was the sole reason for the stop. (not speed, lift, tires, seatbelts etc).

I am going to fight it and need to know if I stand a chance.

From: www.pacode.com

§ 175.80. Inspection procedure.

(4) Check the door operation, including the tailgate, and reject if one or more of the following apply:

(i) The doors, except a tailgate on a pick-up truck, are not on the vehicle if originally fitted by the manufacturer.

COMMENT: Pgs 26, 27 & 28 of the 2007 Owners Manual cover the removal and reinstallation of the factory doors - as if this is a NORMAL owner feature such as turning the ignition key and moving the automatic transmission shift lever from P to D. It would appear that the manufacturer "FITTED" this vehicle to be with or without doors. There is no wording about when it is acceptable to remove the doors.

(ii) The doors, including the tailgate, do not open and close securely, unless the vehicle has been manufactured or modified to the extent that there is no roof or side.

COMMENT: by removing the doors, haven't I modified the vehicle to the extent that there is no side, and in line with the procedures of the owners manual

End of PA CODE


I am aware of the sticker on the soft top (I have a soft top) but this is going to be about the officer and judges interpretation of the vehicle inspection code for which the citation was written, not about the saftey of the factory doors.

PLEASE - I don't fault the officer and I don't want this thread to be about wether or not the officer should have written the citation.

I hope that I do get to have a hearing on this and that it is not dismissed because the officer does not show up - don't know if that is valid in pa or not. But it something I want to put to rest once and for all.

Thanks in advance for any input.

Jim

simon

That's BS! I drove all around PA for many years with my doors off. I never received a ticket, nor should you have. Jeeps are designed to take the doors off, just like UPS, FedEx, or US Postal Service trucks. They have the sliding door and I can not see how that is any different. I would have referenced those trucks when the cop pulled you over. Fight it!

jim07x

Again this is about an inspection violation, those examples you stated are commercial vehicles and are subject to different chapters of the code. But again, thanks for the support!

jim07x

Hatfield PA, (19440) by a Hatfiled Boro Officer.

Cruiser

I'd say fight it but in hatfield you dont have much chance in winning,, Also it IS ileagal in Pa to remove the doors on the jeeps that were made after 83? The YJ was the end of the line, when that came out it ended. Dont look in the pa code of inspection but in the regular part of the vehicle code. See when the YJ's came out they came standard with a door, before that on the cj models doors were optional. The big ins. companies put an end to that years ago. The reason you can get away with it in pa is most LEO dont want to be bothered and also most dont know vehicle code at all.. That said I take my doors off and drive in pa too,, I avoid hatfield and up north in catawissa, near knobles amusement park..
Good luck,,
If I find the code that reads you can remove I'll post it up for you,, or ask over on BMJA.org they are a local jeep club, based out of hamburg pa and lots of those guys have gone thru the same thing you are right now...

jim07x

Thanks Cruiser - what is it about District Court in Souderton that has you saying I don't have much of a chance?

Renegade

This from another thread which talks about a proposed change in that law...

Cruiser

I've delt with the district courts before in that area and know several of the LEO in the Hatfield area personally.. I used to work at Milko's auto repair on Main St. years ago. We serviced many of the Hatfield cop's personal vehicles.. I was there for 4 years and Driving home one night I got pulled over and given a hard time about the reg sticker on my plate.. I had it on the front seat with me,, I put it on and then was given more grief about that.. And I knew the guy.. I was also one day out of the month,, at least my insp. sticker was good!

Oh,, the district courts there seem to side with the LEO 99% of the time,, thats why I say that,, but that being said,, I would still fight it.. There is an exclusion in the vehicle code about the doors that does make it a gray area..

Lorrel

Looks like you were ticketed for violation of code 175.80.(4).(i)

(4) Check the door operation, including the tailgate, and reject if one or more of the following apply:

(i) The doors, except a tailgate on a pick-up truck, are not on the vehicle if originally fitted by the manufacturer.

That said, it is inspection criteria, and a ploice officer is within his rights and responsibility to stop you for this, and any other vehicle equipment violation, however I have never heard of any officer issuing a citation for running without doors on a Jeep in the Lancaster area, I have seen a few pulled over for the tires extending out past the fenders/flairs.
I myself got pulled over for having a clear plastic cover over my liscence plate. The officer gave me the opportunity to remove the cover on site or recieve a ticket. I removed the cover. Another time I was stopped for not having covers on the lights mounted on my roof rack. Again I was given the opportunity to install the covers, which I did.
IN what area of the stae do you live?

jim07x

Hatfield is a northern suburb of Philadelphia (about 10 miles up the N/E extension)

This "FITTED" as it relates to the removability of the doors is probably going to be the root of the decision.